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Strange Dog Problems

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10 replies to this topic

#1
LivisMom

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Hello All, Semi-new here... I would like to start this post by saying the following: I am a licensed vet tech and have worked in the veterinary industry for more years than I would like to admit to :) Although I am currently not working at a clinic (back at school full time) my pups still get regular vet care, and I have been working with my doctors on the problems that I am having... Having said that, cresteds are not common dogs and tend to have specialized problems :) Since vets don't see them very often (I can count on one hand the number that I have seen come in for care), I wanted to ask around in a crest-ful place and see if I anybody has similar problems. This is long and detailed, so grab a cup of coffee and settle in. Olivia is 11 years old, has had sporadic epileptic seizures since she was about 4, has a grade 4-5/6 heart murmur, but until about 5 months ago was otherwise perfectly healthy. Seizures only happened once every few months, were fairly short and required no medications. She has been on lasix and enalapril for her heart for years now and has had routine echocardiograms that all come back being ok... although we are due for another echo, but has had chest films recently with no increase in heart size. One night at the end of November, I woke up in the middle of the night and could hear a strange noise that I at first thought was my other dog snoring, but then realized that it was Liv's heart beating. Didn't get much sleep the rest of the night :) Consulted with my vet the next morning, decided to monitor her as she was feeling fine and ate breakfast, etc. A couple of days later she had an "episode" while eating breakfast, in which I initially thought she was choking or having a seizure, but now know better. She flipped onto her back from a standing position, was rather limp, tongue turned a bit blue.. but when I picked her up she recovered almost immediately. Would not eat. So off for a check up we went, did another chest x-ray, which showed no significant change from her previous films 6 months ago, but she did have some crackles in her lungs, so we increased her lasix and started her on antibiotics to hopefully prevent pneumonia (which she has had a couple of times from aspirating vomit :( ) I continued to be able to hear her heartbeat on and off when it was quiet, and she developed a "clicking" noise when she exhaled. Also decided to go on a hunger strike where I proceeded to buy every kind of dog food imaginable (and home cooking).. she would eat each thing I tried only one time. This went on for a couple of weeks.. and then suddenly she was eating like normal again. Also at this time she started sounding very moist in her respirations. Kinda like a piggy when she was leaning down to eat, and would occasionally just have liquid drip out of her nose. Not thick like snot, or colored, just clear thin fluid. We were doing really well, and I thought we were out of the woods, but then on Jan 1 she had another big episode, was walking beside of me and just flipped onto her back, had large amounts of clear thin fluid come of out her nose. This time she didn't recover very quickly, open mouth breathing and turning purple, so back to the vet we go. Starting her again on antibiotics and got an injection of lasix to go along with her normal oral dose. Second episode that same day, then seemed to level back out. Beginning of February we had the same thing happen again, and went back in for another emergency visit to the vet, and again at end of March. Since then her episodes have been less traumatic, but far more frequently. She will simply fall over when walking and maybe or maybe not have liquid come from her nose. Typically she recovers very quickly. To me these do not appear to be seizures. She never had the typical shaking seizures, she had special Liv seizures where her front legs became still and went up over her head... and this is completely different. She will either just fall to the side, or go over on her back like a bronco that bucks up and goes too far. That's the only way I can think to describe it. Almost all of the time she will have the liquid out of her nose, and she will sit with her head up for a bit afterwards, I think trying to clear out her nose. Has anybody ever seen something like this?? Bloodwork done in February was normal, x-ray done at that same time was ok. I am reluctant to do anything invasive - partly because I simply don't have the budget, but also because 99% of the time she is happy and feeling good, and I can't imagine that we would find something that could be fixed.. I'm completely against doing diagnostics just to find a explanation. THANK YOU for reading to the end :) Summer

#2
GrandCynth

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Of all the odd things I have experienced with my cresteds over a 16 year period, this is not one of them. Must be very scary when it happens to her. I hope someone will come along with some input for you. I do know a number of members have cresteds with various degrees of heart murmurs, but I've not heard of these "episodes" your girl is having, with liquid running from her nose, etc.   :sad:


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#3
jakksmum

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don't know if this is relevant , but we had a Chihuahua that had spells just like that and it turned out to be kidney failure....even though we thought it was because of her enlarged heart



#4
Laura

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Has she had a neuro workup?  Don't want to alarm you, but the fluid coming from the nose could be cerebrospinal fluid from the brain.  I've heard of this in humans, though not in dogs.  Still, I'd try to find a neurological specialist to consult.  

 

You can use this link to find a veterinary neurologist:  http://www.acvim.org...Specialist.aspx  


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#5
DebbsHereNow

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wow! sorry to hear this. I sure hope they find the problem


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#6
Hairy Junebugs

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Yeah, the first thing I thought was neurological too. We had a Crested that had heart disease and he would go in and out of heart failure and he also had seizures, very scary, can;t remember anything running out his nose though. Maybe just a consult with a neuro could give you some answers. 

 

Hope someone can help give you a diagnosis. 


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#7
LivisMom

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Thanks guys. I will keep the neurologist in mind, I have a couple that we refer clients to that I trust. As I said, when she is not having episodes she doesn't seem to be in any sort of distress, and limited funds right now will limit my diagnostics... really was just wondering if this may be something any e on here has seen before. She has stumped my vets :( hope everyone had a good Easter!

#8
Ups N Downs

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I've never heard of a dog presenting in this way.  Very strange.  I hope you can find some answers for her. 



#9
Laura

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Thanks guys. I will keep the neurologist in mind, I have a couple that we refer clients to that I trust. As I said, when she is not having episodes she doesn't seem to be in any sort of distress, and limited funds right now will limit my diagnostics... really was just wondering if this may be something any e on here has seen before. She has stumped my vets :( hope everyone had a good Easter!

 

If it's a rare neurological problem, we probably won't have experienced it, but hopefully if someone here has, they will speak up.  I wish we had more to offer you.  Best of luck to you both.  


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#10
yecartmannew

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I hope you find some answers, but can't help myself I'm afraid.



#11
Davyde

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Have you considered the possibility that it is syncope? Sir Benjamin (the Shih Tzu in my avatar) suffered from this.

http://vet.tufts.edu...s/fainting.html

http://www.petmd.com...al/c_dg_syncope

 

As I understand it, there is a sudden drop in blood pressure which temporarily starves the brain of oxygen, causing the dog to collapse, then be disorientated when it comes round. The sometimes drool or lose control of their bladder as well.

This most often occurs when the dog wakes (for some reason the heart fails to speed up from it's sleep rythm and doesn't meet the waking brain's oxygen requirements) but it can occur at any other time, as we found with Ben.

 

If it is syncope, the thing to do is keep an eye on the dog and make sure it keeps breathing, but don't fuss over it or try to help it. This seems counter intuitive, and feels absolutely horrible to do to a beloved pet; but if you fuss over the dog, it tries to react to you, which causes it's brain and body to demand more oxygen that the heart and lungs aren't supplying.

The good news is that there is virtually never any lasting effect, and the dog itself isn't aware of what's going on, so does not actually suffer as much distress as it appears to. They are, however, very confused when they come round, so that is the time to cuddle and comfort them.


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